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Thread: Oriental Celluloid - discussions about Asian films, and all things Japan =)

  1. #61
    AUF Friend - My Best Friend Girlfriends Sister (500+) kobeson's Avatar
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    I just skim the subs, and unless it's a really talkative film I usually get by fine. When you get a film full of dialogue it can become a bit difficult if the film is also very picturesce.

    Quote Originally Posted by RayTraced View Post
    I can get over most average voice dubbing so its no big deal for me. plus just cause u dont understand a langauge dosnt automatically make it good voice acting. I understand the logic on why u would wanna listen to words u dont understand.
    I get what you mean, like it is difficult to understand the meanings behind certain intonation in sentences and such if you don't know the language.

    But:

    1. Doesn't the fact that what you are hearing is in a complete different language to what you are watching? And on the flipside to this, when they cast an English speaking actor to play the part of somebody from another country - ie. Tom Cruise in Valkyrie. It's so ignorant!!

    2. Don't you hate watching an actors lips completely out of synch to the English words spoken over the top?

    3. Most importantly, it is dumbing down the director's intent and completely ruins the vibe of the film.

    I guess if you're watching a big dumb action film or some random anime, but it is impure and ignorant to have to have it dubbed into English imo.
    I know a lot of people from other countries have it no other way - there are hardly any cinemas in France where English films have French subtitles apparently. I would assume a lot of other countries would be the same.

    If I only watched a couple of foreign films here and there, I guess dubs wouldn't bother me. But 50% of the films I watch aren't in English, so I guess that's why I am so against it.
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    Does The Simpsons count as something Asian? Its drawn out in Korea

    I only think dubs work in animation where lip-syncing isnt a problem.

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    An interesting article I found on bad subtitle.

    All this is leading up to my report on a poorly subtitled film I saw last week. The film was Juno, and I watched it on DVD in English with subtitles in Spanish. It was clear that the subtitler was out of their depth in understanding English. Here are some examples. I compare the original dialogue to my translation into English of the Spanish subtitle....


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    Yeah, I agree with Otis. Although, I tried the dub on Mononoke one and didn't like it. I think some Anime I still need in their original language...

    @Choc - did you work all that out yourself? Are you fluent in Spanish??
    EDIT lol nevermind, I glanced over it before realising the whole thing was a copy/paste

    Geez, those are some terrible translations tho! Completely misguiding and hilariously wrong, all of them!!
    Last edited by kobeson; 25-01-2010 at 12:52 PM.
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    Next time I see Mononoke I'll try with subtitles instead of the english track. I thought Disney did a good job of it though. Didnt Lasseter of Pixer take direction of Mononoke and Spirited?

    My next viewing of Mononoke could be as soon as a couple months away!!

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    AUF Friend - My Best Friend Girlfriends Sister (500+) kobeson's Avatar
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    Oh lol well there you go... it is probably a good example of dubbing, and withthe animals it gets away with it I suppose, but I preferred the original...

    So much to look at though, same goes for Spirited Away and Howl's Moving Castle...
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    When i said dubbing was better i meant on pokemon and naruto, pretty much coz i have only ever watched the dubbed versions and love them.
    But the asian film i have seen, they were subbed and i enjoyed that.
    (along the same lines, Pans Labyrinth was subbed and that was sick, even though it was like Spanish or something)

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    It was from Spain and in Spanish!! Great bloody film, already double dipped it after owning for only two months.

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    Hmmm - ropey subtitles.

    Makes me think of those cheapo DVDs you can buy in Thailand or China (or anywhere else in Asia). Silver disc, semi-decent packaging (as long as you don't try and read what it says), subtitles that have been translated though listening to the film in English, to <insert language here>, and then back to English. The match between the dialog and what's on screen is almost laughable.

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    I think subs probably only need to translate roughly what they are saying. cause at least then u still have a rough idea on whats going on in the movie, and that can be enough sometimes. cause like kobes and otis said some langauges dont have certain words in the english langauge.

    And I only liked dubs over anime and animation, cause like otis said the lip syncing isnt a problem in that meduim. Its just me though when I say I enjoy something I understand rather than having to frikken read everything. its more easier listening to things than to read if u ask me. but I know people enjoy things differently so, im not saying thers something wrong with reading subs. just saying my likes.
    Last edited by RayTraced; 25-01-2010 at 04:08 PM.

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    I went over some of the old film PMs kobes and came across Woman in the Dunes. I wanna see it now and noticed it as #1 in your list.

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    TBH dubbing rarely sounds or looks as natural or as good. This can be very noticeable in films and anime. I have nothing against reading subtitles. Seeing as the subtitles are ON THE SCREEN. I can often see both, meaning I'm not missing much. And rarely is a high action scene coupled with excessivee dialogue. When was the last time you saw a huge gun fight go hand in hand with verbal diahorrea? They don't and a director is often aware that while action is on, keep the talking down. And when action is off, talking up.

    Pretty straightforward.

    Plus, English people have a habit of destroying everything. Including quality Asian films. Anime has probably suffered worst from the invasion of the Western world. You read the manags of say Yu-gi-oh or Naruto then watch the Westernised thing. COMPLETELY DIFFERENT.

    Anyways. Sub > Dub IMO.
    Quote Originally Posted by Capt_Jack_West View Post
    Well it's been a hell of a ride with amazing highs *remembers the time when k-brad got his tax back + interest* and terrifying lows *ponders reps criminal past coming back to haunt him*

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    Completely agree on everything REP

    It is only the dialogue heavy films that need constant looking up and down. Peripheral vision and skimming has got me by over the years with subtitles, so I actually enjoy reading the dialogue unless I am tired anyway.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Chocito View Post
    An interesting article I found on bad subtitle.

    All this is leading up to my report on a poorly subtitled film I saw last week. The film was Juno, and I watched it on DVD in English with subtitles in Spanish. It was clear that the subtitler was out of their depth in understanding English. Here are some examples. I compare the original dialogue to my translation into English of the Spanish subtitle....
    LOL Chocito that was classic!! Repped!!

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    Hana-bi was just as good as Beat Takeshi's other three films that I've seen. That's now for films of his that I like, safe to say he's among my fave filmmakers now.

    My only disappointment was that the cover art's imagery didnt directly appear in it anywhere. I thought it would of looked terrific in the film.



    It did, just not in that form.

    If you like Takeshi then you'll love this.

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    AUF Friend - My Best Friend Girlfriends Sister (500+) kobeson's Avatar
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    So is it the best of the 3 Takeshi's you've seen?

    I'm putting Mother into my top non-Japanese list, was brilliant!

    http://www.imdb.com/title/tt1216496/

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    I've seen four now - Dolls, Zatoichi, Takeshis' and now Hana-bi.

    All of them offer something different. If I had to pick one from them all it would be Hana-bi because its most like Takeshis'. Going to seek Sonatine next. Its weird going back and seeing him get younger hahaha

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    Takeshi has a new film due out late this year
    He plays in the lead role of a low ranking yakuza who does the higher ranking boss' work.
    The trailer is just a teaser without subs but it's still a confirmation!!


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    Nice, will keep an eye out - I've still only seen the one of his I think, I will get to Hanabi one a these days... you should imdb Seijun Suzuki Otis, I think you might like his films... kinda the old version of Beat Takeshi, perhaps a bit less restrained even...
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    Anyone seen Erotic Ghost Story? Was an old favourite of mine watching SBS as a youngster...lol. Probably deserves its own thread it was that good.

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    Haha yeah I have seen 2 of them I think, pretty cool B-grade films, they are always on SBS

    Go ahead with your thread, see how many replies you get! lol
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    asian vaginas taste ike shrimp

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    Quote Originally Posted by OtisBDriftwood View Post
    Takeshi has a new film due out late this year
    He plays in the lead role of a low ranking yakuza who does the higher ranking boss' work.
    If anyone is interested here is the link to the official website.

    http://office-kitano.co.jp/outrage/index.html

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joshizzled View Post
    asian vaginas taste ike shrimp
    Is that right??

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    Quote Originally Posted by Chocito View Post
    If anyone is interested here is the link to the official website.

    http://office-kitano.co.jp/outrage/index.html
    Is it only just a new site? Doesnt appear there's much to navigate around.

    Did you watch the trailer? I hope they werent saying the most horrid lines

    @kobes - what of Seijun Suzuki would you suggest? He has a big back-catalogue!

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    Quote Originally Posted by OtisBDriftwood View Post
    Is it only just a new site? Doesnt appear there's much to navigate around.

    Did you watch the trailer? I hope they werent saying the most horrid lines

    @kobes - what of Seijun Suzuki would you suggest? He has a big back-catalogue!
    Yeah it's only a teaser site I'd say. Not much other than a trailer and brief outline of the storyline.

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    Suzuki is an acquired taste I think, I have seen a couple that didn't grab me, but Tokyo Drifter and Branded to Kill are definitely his 2 best I think - restored in HD they would be awesome. He created some incredible visuals...

    Have you seen any Seijun films Chocito? And, which of Takeshi's films have you seen also?
    Last edited by kobeson; 16-02-2010 at 11:37 AM.
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    nice list Kobeson....Tae Guk Gi is one of the best war movies i have seen..

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    Quote Originally Posted by kobeson View Post
    Suzuki is an acquired taste I think, I have seen a couple that didn't grab me, but Tokyo Drifter and Branded to Kill are definitely his 2 best I think - restored in HD they would be awesome. He created some incredible visuals...

    Have you seen any Seijun films Chocito? And, which of Takeshi's films have you seen also?
    Can't say I've seen much of Seijun films. I have heard of Tokyo Drifter though.

    As for Takeshi, I know him more form his TV show days (ie.Takeshi's Castle) so not much of his movies. I have seen and LOVED 'Zatoichi' and some of 'Violent Cop' but remember turning it off as it was too much.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Joshizzled View Post
    asian vaginas taste ike shrimp
    I'm sure jess would be interested to know this.
    Quote Originally Posted by Capt_Jack_West View Post
    Well it's been a hell of a ride with amazing highs *remembers the time when k-brad got his tax back + interest* and terrifying lows *ponders reps criminal past coming back to haunt him*

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